You are so mistaken. Don't be fooled. I want to ask you "Who created you?". There is God and he created this world and us human being to believe in him. He is our Creator and if you believe in him then you don't die but we go from life to life. There is a life after death, internal life with our God (Creator). If you don't recognize God as your own Savior, then you will spend your afterlife in hell and will suffer in flames. So, if you dind't open your heart for God yet, please do so and ask him to come into your heart. Ask him to forgive your sins, we all have sins but God's blood cleans all of our sins if we ask him to. Your life will change and you will be the child of God the Creator. The time is very short and Godwill soon come for his Bride (church). If you take a close look at what is going on around this world, then you will definitely say that its going to the end.

Pics or it didn't happen.

Hold on, he is right. Our soul dies indeed. Our spirit is the essence that appears in so many many photos and in hospital rooms all over the world. The spirit is attached by an etheric silver cord, much like a fishing line, that is cleaved when we leave our bodies. This is empirical scientific fact. Most people today aren't educated in any way toward the celestial sciences so they can't respond easily.

@Nadia-1572790: "Internal life with our God"... you mean, like, God eats us?

Ewwww.

"so many many photos and in hospital rooms all over the world" .... show me some of them

There is God and he created this world and us human being to believe in him. He is our Creator and if you believe in him then you don't die but we go from life to life.

Nadia - If an all-powerful, all-knowing and merciful God created this world, all I can say is he must have been having an off day.

I honestly can't see how anybody can believe an entity which is both all powerful and loving could have created the world we live in.

Just open the paper and read about starvation, about the rape and abuse of women and the murder of children in the Sudan. Are you seriously saying somebody planned things this way?

Why?

There may be a God and there may be an afterlife, but if there is I wouldn't count too much on the intercession of this God in this life, or that the next life will be in a world better constructed than this one.

There is no "soul" or "spirit". And there is certainly no empirical evidence at all for a soul. What you see in photos is light reflecting off something, something wrong with the film, or a pure and simple hoax made by crafty huxters.

Nadia says, <blockquote>"Who created you?". There is God and he created this world and us human being to believe in him.</blockquote>

I learned in fifth grade that Mommy and Daddy created me because they really loved each other and hugged for a long time. Did you miss that class? You should ask your parents to explain it to you.

Nadia, your god has blood? That is used to clean stuff? If you don't mind me saying, your god is a sicko!

Mommy and Daddy created me because they really loved each other and hugged for a long time.

I heard it wasn't such a long time.

Only a Jehovah's Witness would write such an answer.

Nadia, have you ever stopped to think about what kind of individual would condemn a couple, and all of their children for countless thousands of generations to eternal suffering, death, disease, and misfortune for eating a bit of fruit?

Have you ever stopped to consider what kind of psychopathic freak would send someone to eternal damnation to have their flesh burned away by molten lava for eternity just simply because they chose not to believe in him when he goes to such lengths to hide himself?

What kind of sick freak thinks this is actually the signs of a *good* god? Think about that.

if god created us... then who or what created god?

As an atheist I find the belief in gods and spirits, in any shape or form, as the ultimate proof of the mind's insanity. To me the human mind is the result of an over-evolution of the human brain. No human being needs to be smarter than a chipmunk to know how to survive. Over-evolution is not a bad thing in itself, though. Thank goodness for the pleasures the arts and sciences can afford us. But it does allow for humans to take things to an irrational extreme like, for example, the feeling of getting rid of an entire ethnic group as a way to achieve "peace". So I see the belief in gods and spirits as an irrational extreme. The idea that you have to perform religious rituals, or that the universe is incapable of coordinating itself without some kind of conscious power manipulating it from afar is, to me, simply demented.
I think we humans have more than enough on our plate trying to survive and get along with each other. The belief in myths and superstitions only help to complicate things. It adds another set of problems we have to deal with. It's no coincidence we humans look in wonderment and envy at children and animals. Because we see in them the simplicity we all need to make life better.
Be yourself, be happy, and let others be the same. Everything beyond that is scrambled eggs.

Nadia, have you ever stopped to think about what kind of individual would condemn a couple, and all of their children for countless thousands of generations to eternal suffering, death, disease, and misfortune for eating a bit of fruit?

Somebody who's a stickler for rules and has a long memory.

'Hey the sign says, "Do not eat!". You got a problem with your eyes or something?"

No human being needs to be smarter than a chipmunk to know how to survive.

That is not really true, esam. Human beings developed intelligence to compensate for our extreme physical feebleness. We cannot run up and down trees like a chipmunk, smell out food like a dog, or outrun even the slowest of predators. Our claws and teeth are a joke.

So we need our intelligence to coordinate group actions, and to develop tools to compensate for our slow and weak bodies.

By extension, our ability to plan, to develop abstract ideas and inventions, does make us capable (or susceptible) to seeing patterns where none exist and imagining we can control, through prayer and ritual, things which are uncontrollable. Our concepts of God, be they Christian, Muslim, Jewish or Hindu, are probably just an outgrowth of this process.

However, none of the above precludes the existence of a God, or supreme being. But given the state of this world, it seems unlikely that this being, if he exists, is overly concerned with the fate of humanity, or whether I go to Church each Sunday.

If what you say is true, why do you think you have a soul? Why have a soul at all?

nadia wrote: "If you don't recognize God as your own Savior, then you will spend your afterlife in hell and will suffer in flames."

=======================================================

I'm afraid you seriously over-estimate the ability of your god to intimidate me.

My wife's grandmother had a "near death" experience. Here two of her kids were there when she went into cardiac arrest. They were asked if they should resuscitate her. They said "yes". The medical staff were able to bring her back. When she awoke she said "Why did you bring me back? I was fine where I was at."

There are way too many cases like this to say there is a hereafter. People who deny this only want to live to day, for themselves.

The afterlife is all made-up concocted religious bull@!$%#. Just like religion is bull@!$%#.

@ Kuro-1572859

"Pics or it didn't happen."

You win. Your Internet is in the mail.

Nice thought....you wish!

Can you explain a soul? What is a soul? Where do souls come from.

Souls are spiritual lives...

Life can be view like the caterpillar-butterfly. This current life is the caterpillar stage but our soul is the butterfly stage.

As for what we previously written about the troubles in our world, God didn't cause those troubles Man did. God gives us freedom to make our own choices. He doesn't rule over us with a heavy hand he lets us do what we want. The problem is a bunch of us make bad choices. After a while all that stuff piles up.

For you unbelievers out there I have a couple of questions for you. "When did time begin? When does it end? Where does space stop? What's behind that?

Our limited human brain cannot comprehend everything, so just maybe there might be a spirit being out there that does more than just us little humans do.

If you really want true peace and happiness in your life....not religion.....you may just want to check Him out. I think you'll find there's way more too it than what you see today represented in the Religious establishment. God gives us a relationship not a religion. I promise its way worth it.

Good luck you guys.

Those of you who are posting about all the troubles in the world as reason to deny God, clearly have not experienced a "near-death" experience. as they are called. If you had, you would have absolutely no doubt about the fact that there is a God, there is an afterlife, and God is Love...not the director or cause of our suffering, but rather our hope and promise that helps(our Holy Spirit) bring us through the suffering, with faith in anticipation of our eventual return to the all emcompassing, pure, peaceful Love that we yearn for (to return to, eternally, actually). Although it is very hard to try to put into words, the only way I can try to explain that is to say that the part of your being that is "love" joins with God, and that is all there is with God...an unimaginable Love that cannot be described. Maybe you should think about keeping God, Faith and "Love" in your life here, lest there be nothing left of your being to go on with God?

Those of you who are posting about all the troubles in the world as reason to deny God, clearly have not experienced a "near-death" experience. as they are called. If you had, you would have absolutely no doubt about the fact that there is a God, there is an afterlife, and God is Love

No, we'd probably still be rational. http://www.science-frontiers.com/sf095/sf095m99.htm

the only way I can try to explain that is to say that the part of your being that is "love" joins with God, and that is all there is with God

So God is a pool of dopamine, oxytocin, and phenylethylamine?

Oh, and I forgot to mention...with God, there is no "time" or "things" as humans count time and possessions...with God, there is just "being".

JatsuSama

Concerning the article link you posted, clearly it would seem that Lansberry never reached the "joining with God"...or "Being" in Heaven, when she had her "NEAR death experience". Anyways, you do not have to believe me, but there is nothing "irrational" about knowing there is an afterlife.

Of course not. Then again, neither did anyone else who had a "NEAR death experience," which you claimed would instantly turn anyone who experiences one into a believer.

Then again, neither did anyone else who had a "NEAR death experience"

I think you are misinformed about that...and, as for Lansberry, I do not know what experience she had, but maybe it was not truly an experience of leaving her body... I cannot imagine her denying an afterlife is she had TRULY experienced being out of her body. Anyways, I am not sure why you popped up on this board to question my statement, but I wish you well.

I think you are misinformed about that...and, as for Lansberry, I do not know what experience she had, but maybe it was not truly an experience of leaving her body... I cannot imagine her denying an afterlife is she had TRULY experienced being out of her body.

Do you have any empirical evidence that anyone TRULY experienced leaving their body, as opposed to merely believing they did?

Jat...

I believe there is a documented case of a man who returned to his body (in a hospital) and was able to tell the medical care givers that there was a tennis shoe up on the roof of the hospital...that he could not have known unless he was able to "see" above the hospital. I am quite sure there are other cases where the person could relate things that they could not have known/seen if they were not able to "sense" things outside of the body's limits. Maybe you should read the book for some answers. Now, I know you are going to ask for reference sources and proof and all of that...you can look it up...I don't need to prove it to myself. Again, you may want to think about reconsidering your beliefs...just my opinion.

Oh, that is so sad!

I believe there is a documented case of a man who returned to his body (in a hospital) and was able to tell the medical care givers that there was a tennis shoe up on the roof of the hospital...that he could not have known unless he was able to "see" above the hospital.

Quite a few rooves have shoes on them. Now, how many people had a NDE, said they saw a shoe on the roof, and were wrong? It's kind of like a psychic that makes 100 predictions, gets 2 correct, and only talks about those 2.

Maybe it was his shoe. Ever think of that?

Welcome all,

I am one man who has lived many lives and has died many deaths. We all do. The seeming contradiction between science and diverse scriptures, including but certainly not limited to the Holy Bible, is in fact a scenario where BOTH schools of thought are congruent. Any human being that is of an exceptionally high intelligent quotient, such as myself, will be confident of the knowledge they have gained thus far in their life. Our plea for the entire human race is this:

"While your efforts to learn and gain understanding of the forces that exist in the earth and universe are noble and worthwhile, the "LAW OF ONE" that has existed since before the foundation of space-time, OFFERS humanity the LUXURY of being safe and fine by simply acknowledging that we will never know the depth and detail of this infinite space we share together. This concept is known to you as FAITH. "

"You need not be concerned with differences of indoctrination or cultural divides, as these are so very insignificant in the whole of things. Accept the truth you already know. That is to say, you are a living being that knows love. Love is the One universal energy that has no beginning and no end. Little do you know that the spark of love that each of you live and breathe everyday amongst your family and friends is in fact the creative force that all things are borne of. How many of you, regardless of your nationality, race, religion or creed, can go unaffected at the thought of harm to your children? Infinitely more powerful is the Love with which a morsel is granted to you, the depth of which you could never imagine."

"So important therefore it is, to accept the acceptance that contains no risk of shame or humiliation for each of you were born in the very same manner, and each of you will pass in the very same. Choose today to accept what has been placed before you as a sign from ONE to all of you that the gift already provided to all mankind, delivered 2,010 years ago by the Nazarene, who simply agreed to face the ultimate betrayal. And in achieving death, that Universal Love, defeated the forces of "antilove" and betrayal so no human need ever face betrayal in the continuance of life."

"Faith is the innocence you see in the eyes of your children. How much wiser are you than your children, and how vulnerable are they in their innocent youth. So much more vulnerable and unlearned are you than they compared to the naivete you wear compared to the omnipotent One. Assuredly, you can rest your mind in the knowledge that as your children look with helpless, trusting eyes in faith and hope that you will take care of them, so to are you the very child I speak of whose only hope in life is the forfeiture of your own workability."

For more information as to the empirical evidence we all seek, correspondance may be sent to nineoneone69@gmail.com

Well said! (despite the grammatical errors.)

Wow, a Chaplain with no faith. Sad. "No being on this earth ever died and came back to answer this question truly" Hmm, ever hear of Jesus Christ?

You being a Chaplain for Vets and as a Vet myself I truly feel sorry for those you counsel. If you have no faith/belief in the Word of God why continue in your current position? It`s like a plane salesman who doesn't believe in the ability to fly. Or, maybe a better, more pertinent term would be, Hypocrite.

I am one man who has lived many lives and has died many deaths.

Sure you are.

@Mark, #2.3

That's a foolish analogy if I've ever heard one. In foremost, he does state his belief in Christ, but take a second to think about what you said; I can take you down to the airport and show you a plane. You can watch one or ride in it and see it fly -- empirical proof. I can't however go down to a church and ask for Jesus to appear, then take a moment of his time to die and resurrect to prove the afterlife.

Perhaps, like a reasonable person, our Chaplain here is interpreting the more 'magical' elements of the Bible as metaphor, as an uplifting story of limitless love and redemption for any man. Perhaps he has faith in the ability for God to unite the world in peace. He's not a hypocrite, he's just not a fool.

I for one am definately looking forward to the afterlife. My God is Jesus Christ, He is love.

Those of you who are bitter about their lives or the world please pray to God to reveal Himself to you. And be sincere.

Ann of Green Gables was a fictitious character just like all the 25000 gods in history and especially the xtians^ best buddy GeeZeus. If anyone believes in such nonsense, he/she should be in a mental hospital in a straight jacket! There is no option!

@mark - Narrow minded. Clearly if people can't interpret scripture like you they must be wrong.

@an of green gables - I prayed once and got Chuck Norris's answering machine. :-(

Ann of Green Gables

I for one am definately looking forward to the afterlife. My God is Jesus Christ, He is love.

Those of you who are bitter about their lives or the world please pray to God to reveal Himself to you. And be sincere.

You believe do ya?
( and for all of you who pray & believe in this "loving" god)....
well then, PLEASE tell me this...

Do tell why your all powerful and loving ,places on earth and allows these sick & twisted bastards to kidnap, torture, beat, rape and kill the inocent babies & children????( any person really).

Would you be all about forgiving and loving a sick pig that did any of these things to your children or any in your family????

These things ( from what I've been taught ) are NOT LOVE.

I can and never could for the life of me figure out why a loving and forgiving god would allow such horrors to happen to any being let alone an innocent.

Can any of you believers explain this to me, just this one thing( though there are many things to wonder) why a "god" would allow to happen???

WingCrazee

I will try to attempt an answer, one I was taught growing up in catholic school. God made men to have free will. Plain and simple, yet I agree with you and what you're asking, I'm just stating the explanation I've been given. This is in the bible several times over.

I do believe in an afterlife, though I can't really say why. I've had an out of body experience once while at work, it only lasted a few seconds until my phone rang and jolted me back down, but I was floating above myself looking at my back. Don't know why it happened, wasn't sick or anything, just a weird experience. Other things have happened, I knew the instant my grandfather died, and he was 3 hours away from me when it happened.. other strange stuff like that.

Nothing to confirm an after life exists, but yet, I still believe, and more for non religious reasons than others. Anyway, that's my attempt at an answer.

"Can any of you believers explain this to me, just this one thing( though there are many things to wonder) why a "god" would allow to happen???"

God has nothing to do with the misery of the world! Why should there be any intervention, we (humans) have done this to ourselves, in our own arrogance. We were given free will to live as we please, act as we please or we could follow the instructions given to us, to love one another, to help the sick, poor, widows, feed the hungry, clothe the naked and etc.

We are as children, still learning how to "reconnect" to our God, yes we could live in a paradise as before if only we follow the rules. Like the Atheist, the agnostic, the cultist and anyone else that does not believe in God, it is your choice! We have not learned from the past or our mistakes, just like those before us, so yes there is disease, children and innocents are hurt, there are poor and there are the sick and there is all types of illnesses, but in our arrogance we try to put it all on someone/something else! Why, it can't be our fault, we are so intelligent and smart! There have been nonbelievers from the beginning and there will be nonbelievers to the end, everyone will have a way of dealing with their life, wether its religion, evolution, magic or nothing at all, its called Free Will.

Miracles happen everyday, all you have to do is open your eyes. Seems as though that most of us cannot open eyes enough to see them, we need the water turned to wine, or someone to split the seas or even walk on water before we believe! So, there you are.

thanks Lmasure for taking the time to answer..

but that answer just doesn't get it with me.. not good enough

a loving god would never allow such things to happen over & over again,period

Just saying what I was taught. I'm not sure I truly believe everything that's said about God and Bible anyway.. got lots of questions myself.

I will say however, that the existence of free will is also made for you to believe that the person/people who committed - pick a sin - will answer to it when they die and supposedly go to hell.

tom as a chaplain, you know that Jesus told a parable explaining why people "don't come back" Even though someone would come back from the dead, still many will not believe.

So this loving god is going to revive and send millions upon millons of sinners to a fiery pit to burn for eternity? This isn't the kind of thing that a superior being would stoop to. This sounds more like something a primitive barbarian would think up as a just means of punishment for disobeying a direct order. The bible looks and feels like it was written by primitives during a primitive time. Not by a so called God.

Lmasure
thanx again for taking time to answer ;)

All that said above was truth based on fact proven by science, Sorry if those of you may call me someone from the show me state, I really do not care. Truth and fact is proof and validation. All that we know is what is real and now and what has been proven by science and history, everything else can be considered fairytale or mythology. Faith is a belief in something, based on only what one chooses to believe and nothing more except upon some factual thing such as nature. Jesus though the stories of his life and love and teachings are beautiful and ended sad are based only on just that stories. Words passed on with time from people who made up the greatest story ever told and in book form (The Holy Bible) does NOT make for proof of existance. I would imagine since the dawn of man and his infinite questions as to where when why how and etc.. no wonder a belief system was developed to give people dreams, prophecies, hope and some sense of control over their destiny, ultimately rules like laws that govern it's people. If you choose to believe in a GOD and Jesus or any other deity and religion and an afterlife, remember, it is a choice....and...thanks be given to whatever god for "freedom" to do so, lol. It is within yourself, that choice to do just that. Noone has 'proof' of an after life, except personal stories, but from my experience I truly feel we move on in spirit to something. I just do not know what that something is. Another realm perhaps. I do not know that I would call it heaven.

We know from empirical evidence that brains cells for visual functioning are often the first to cease execution in the absence of oxygenated blood. Brain cells can function for about six minutes after they stop receiving oxygen. It would therefore be normal for revived people to see their vision gradually disappear, mimicking a tunnel with white light at the end. This by no means suggests an afterlife; rather, it is a normal part of conscious brain death.

You keep saying empirical evidence, don't know where your getting your "empirical evidence" from but if you depend on science to explain your existence, then you should know that Science, over past 8 or years has now found out that " cells do not die after 6 minutes of no oxygenation" and in fact live for hours after all respirations and blood flow stop. There is a wonderful article onthis called "Treating the Dead" unfortunately I don't have it sitting in front of me at this moment. Life has been restored to people who have died, and without oxygenation for up to 8 hours and brought back! You see, science is made made, Man and many of different beliefs all came up with the knowledge that you possess and call science. So what you choose to believe as proof is only what others have said is proof and your understanding of proof is only what you have been taught is proof. You might it call it faith. Man will never understand all th possibilities of this life or the next. We are really just simply children trying to understand and make sense of our existence. Some choose to believe in evolution, but can you prove it with any impirical evidence?? Religion, can you prove it with impirical evidence??? By the way, does anyone know where the Bible came from, and who wrote it??

Self delusion constructed by your imagination. Our brains give us little illusions such as those you describe, especially during times of grief, just to cheer us up.

Your mind is delusional and your comments indicate an imagination of a 4 year old! For the sake of our society, I hope you are under 4!

Jacqui - I believe you as I've had some instances like that happen several times in my life, (along w/other family members as it happened to them) but like you too many to go into - though if someone asks, I'll be happy to oblige.

I do believe in a God, but not as most would think. I still can't get over the "God created Adam and Eve", and that's where we came from, because no one in any religious institution can come up with a reason for the dinosaurs, and the FACT that we actually have bones of them! Also, in the bible it states that one of their sons got married to a woman - well, where did she come from? They never elaborated on that, because it would have to be his sister and that's just wrong according to the bible.

Lots of stuff I don't get, but I don't believe dying is the absolute end. For those who don't believe in God simply because they don't understand why he allows bad people to do bad things - "God (supposedly) created man (and women) with FREE WILL". That is the ability to do and get away with bad things, but apparently will be taken of when they die as they go to hell.

"Free Will" Ok. I guess God is going to be really busy punishing like 95% of the human population for sins committed in their life time.

Kuro-1572859
Self delusion constructed by your imagination. Our brains give us little illusions such as those you describe, especially during times of grief, just to cheer us up.

That's only an opinion...

you need help friend !!

Exactly the opposite dear. I am the bridge between science and the spiritual. You are a champion in life already and I wish you could understand that. I am 40 years old, and i was very much into the Catholic religion..... worked in Sunday school and had a deep faith. I was also abused by neighborhood and school bullies. I began doubting God becuae what God would allow another person to cause harm. Not just in my circumstance , but all over the world. There are thousands of religions, and all of them are correct in one way or another. I know that people from 3 years old to 100+ years have had NDEs and all tell the same story. Further, they are from all countries outside the U.S. and all the people from ancient world religions different from Christianity still have the same experiences. There is no difference. There are over 20 million documented cases of near death experiences and they are all the same because humans are all the same...we are people born of love. We return to Love when our time on earth is done. Your suffering in life, which has been profound places you into a category of those who will receive great blessings in heaven.

God does allow the things you define as a screwed up world. It's needed for the enlightenment of our souls which then progress into a state of abandonment and utter selflessness. When the Self is defeated, Love is allowed back in. Right now in the world, manking has chosen to allow wickedness and selfish motives to rule our environment. The earth is ruled by the evil forces. The time of the "Great fall" when Lucifer was banished from heaven to the earth. He made the earth his home and has worked tirelessly for thousands of years to draw people away from God much as he has. All the chaos in this world is completely carried out by the hand of Satan, but empowered by the selfishness of mankind. He owns destruction and deception. God created man with great power, the power of choice. Choose you this day whom you will serve, said Jesus. We can't stop evil, and it doesn't matter. What doesn't kill us only makes us stronger. A bone breaks and heals back stronger. A warrior gets defeated and fights back more valiantly.

Your pessimism isn't something to feel bad about, it's your natural urge to protect yourself. That's good! The truth that Jesus Nazarene taught was that the negativity and suffering we experience here on earth is turned inside out in the ethereal realm. The opposite of what is here is there. Suffering, poverty, torcher, and the like, last for a short time in our lives. The resultant effect from such suffering on earth is a more abundant eternity in Heaven. All NDEs have seen only two sides of the universe when passing across, the Heaven or the hell. We do not fear hell because our faith inside our heart is what saves us from death. Faith in what? Faith in the Universal Love that created us and saves us. Sue, I'm sure you love children. You have no idea how much stronger the Love for you is than the love you can give on earth. There is no fear in Love, for perfect Love casts out ALL fear. Fear is the tool of the satanic forces to turn human away from Love and back to our hapless Self.

Run to Love in all you do.

So, run from fear, skepticism, and the villainous deceit that tries to harm you. Run to your Father with your inner child where you look helplessly to the one who cared for you to bring you this far. Run in absolute mindless blindless to the Love you desire. It will not be contained in human form. You know the Love I refer to; you've known it all your life. You have no need to fear, there's no need to skepticize, you only need focus on the Love we will soon see again.

If you read the Bible then you would know why dothings happen around this world. My understanding is that you haven't read the Bible yet. The Bible states clear about everything now and the end of this world. If you would find sometime and read the new testimony of the Bible then you would understand it more. Don't say that there is no God. You can see Him in everything around you.

Skepticism doesn't try to harm us, it's a survival tactic to avoid hucksters and con men spouting nonsense like yours.

@Nadia: The bible was written by men

If God did not allow free will, although some abuse it, what would be the use of living ? It seems across all faiths there is suffering and there can be gain from suffering just as there are losses.

People of great faith don't abuse others, if they are mentally sound and their faith has a strong foundation. Also some predator's of no faith seek out roles as spiritual leaders for the opportunity to abuse others, it makes the world complex.

We had a great earthquate in Haiti - a very sad event but without the movement of the plates in the earth we may not be able to live here at all. I prefer to believe there is a God if for no other reason than to have a moral compass.

@Don V - so if you didn't believe in a god you'd be raping and pillaging to no end? By your reasoning you want to be moral and know what it is to be moral before your belief in a god, yet you want to believe in a god regardless saying that it gives you a moral compass.

Sue - I don't think you had a near death experience at all. From what's been said many times over, hence this article you just read, all of these nde's are virtually the same. They're happy and full of love they've never known before. There weren't any negative remarks from the people who experienced them.

You were freaking out in yours, feeling of being pulled and trying to scream. That in itself says it wasn't an nde. Don't know what it was, but I doubt you had the real thing.

You don't have to believe, that is your choice but please allow us the choice to believe if we want.

Don't use the logic that the Bible is false and God can't exists because bad things happen & so on.

Your premise is flawed based on what the Bible teaches; bad things happen because of the absence of God in our lives "free choice". The first free choice was the first sin committed by Adam & Eve (yes I know that stinks for us but lets face it we would of sinned anyway) that affected the whole world, plants animals, micro organisms, continents, everything.

As humans we can't understand the mind of God (as stated in the Bible) but we can accept His gift of Jesus Christ...but He will in no way force you to do it and I won't try to either.

Don - if there is no free will, then we could be considered just robots. There would be no opportuninty to understand right and wrong.

With a poll showing 80% not believing in an afterlife is a lot of people with a dark, depressive prospect.

Free will is the best thing ever! Everybody gets to choose and stick with their choices! Does this get any better? Now I see why God doesn't interfere with our choices!

Omione...if I ask you to write a letter to my aunt and I dictate and you write it...answer me...who wrote it? You would say you wrote it of course...but I dictated it right? There you go...

"Free Will" seems like a stretch to me. If God expects us to follow his rules why doesn't he show himself? Why would he expect us (in the year 2000)to believe some far out stories written by some primitive sheep hearders hundreds of years ago? It would be only fair for him to make a cameo every now and then and lets us know this is the real deal. That way when we decide to not follow...he can truly drop the hammer on us during judgement day.

psmitty2005
"Free Will" seems like a stretch to me. If God expects us to follow his rules why doesn't he show himself? Why would he expect us (in the year 2000)to believe some far out stories written by some primitive sheep hearders hundreds of years ago? It would be only fair for him to make a cameo every now and then and lets us know this is the real deal. That way when we decide to not follow...he can truly drop the hammer on us during judgement day.

Not all of the stories were written by "primitive sheep herders"..It is our choice to decide whether we believe them or not...

It makes no difference whether you are a believer or an unbeliever. I do not believe you for you offer no verifiable and falsifiable evidence for your claims of there being a "beckoning" toward a luminous object.

With such ideas of fantasy, perhaps you would have been better off just following that light!

richmond, many people who have your experience come back and seek knowledge of spiritual things. Are you doing so too?

Amen Sister - you said it all...

Yes, there's an afterlife, many of us just refuse to believe it and live for the moment as evidenced by all the craziness that's happening in our world today.

Could you please present your scientific evidence and data for review?

I would be interested to see it. I doubt that you could present anything other than anecdotal evidence which I do not accept as valid proof. Until then please quit spouting nonsense such as the above.

-Strong Unapologetic Skeptic and Atheist.

As C.S. Lewis said he's either "Lord, liar or lunatic."

But the easy answer to CS Lewis is:

Liar and lunatic, yes.

Lord, no.

Amen! I'm praying with you

Nadia-1572790
Amen! I'm praying with you

But then, who's thinking for either of you?

As C.S. Lewis said he's either "Lord, liar or lunatic."

This is a false dichotomy (well, trichotomy); each option presented actually requires a piece of information we can't verify -- that Jesus actually existed. It's well documented that there are no historical records of Jesus outside Biblical text, and no first-hand accounts of his existence. While it is possible that he somehow managed to avoid mention by every historian of the era despite his infamy, it's unlikely.

So what about the fourth option? "Fictional." It seems silly that CS Lewis would have missed that, considering his trade, but we all have our off days -- or maybe he just didn't want to ruin his alliteration.

C.S. Lewis is a weak enough apologist without quote mines that fail in logic. He prefaced his liar, lunatic, lord logic with the following: "I am trying here to prevent anyone saying the really foolish thing that people often say about Him: I’m ready to accept Jesus as a great moral teacher, but I don’t accept his claim to be God." Many of us--most of the world in fact--do not accept that Jesus was a great moral teacher and so the Lewis citation has no meaning. Jesus, if he existed at all, was much more likely a creation of the lies of Paul and so a fiction at best. Christians follow a religion about Jesus, not the religion of Jesus.

The reason our country is in such bad shape is because of people like you who waste time praying instead of trying to do something constructive!

Get a life and do something positive!

Too many people have died claiming Christ was who he said he was, and they were killed by being skinned alive, burned at the stake, all proclaiming the same thing. You don't die for something that's a lie.

So those Muslims that forced the planes into the twin towers all the while proclaiming that their version of God is the correct one didn't die for a lie? By your logic, Islam, Hinduism, and thousands of other religions that all claim to be the only correct one are all true because one doesn't die for a lie. Perhaps if I want something to be true, all I have to do is die for it?

Etchainer,
You are wrong.
It is not "It's well documented that there are no historical records of Jesus outside Biblical text"

Flavius Josephus: He was a Jewish historian who was born in 37 CE. He wrote a book, Antiquities of the Jews circa 93 CE, probably between the times when Luke & John were written. He described Jesus as a wise man who was crucified by Pilate. The passage appears below.

---

"About this time arose Jesus, a wise man, He drew to himself many; and when Pilate, on the indictment of the principal men among us, had condemned him to the cross, those who had loved him at the first did not cease to do so, And even to this day the race of Christians, who are named from him, has not died out."
---

Origen, published a book Contra Celsum circa 254 CE, over 150 years after Josephus' book Antiquities of the Jews. In it, Origen wrote that Josephus did not believe that Jesus was the Christ:

"For in the 18th book of his Antiquities of the Jews, Josephus bears witness to John as having been a Baptist, and as promising purification to those who underwent the rite. Now this writer [Josephus], although not believing in Jesus as the Christ, in seeking after the cause of the fall of Jerusalem and the destruction of the temple ..."

Origen also published a book Commentary on Matthew which also contained a reference to Josephus rejecting Jesus as Christ. He wrote:

"And the wonderful thing is, that, though he [Josephus] did not accept Jesus as Christ, he yet gave testimony that the righteousness of James was so great; and ...
---

Josephus was not a believer in Christ (like you) but he did document the fact that He did live.
You don't have to believe in Him but there is outside evidence that he existed, so please don't lie about it.

dichosa,
I think I see what you're trying to say but you failed to notice the difference in the two.
The disciples did not kill others because of their faith; they themselves were killed by others because of their faith
Big difference.

Voice of Reason - Analysis of Josephus' writings indicate that he did not write the portions about "Jesus". They are in a totally different style and were probably added about 200 years later.

Mary E.C.
Yes, there's an afterlife, many of us just refuse to believe it and live for the moment as evidenced by all the craziness that's happening in our world today. If you don't think there's anything after this, why be good? Why help other people? Why not just live selfishly and only strive to get as much as you can in this world? Hmmm, that sounds so much like what is happening right now. Jesus lived--you don't have to have the Bible to see evidence of that--other people of his time wrote about him. As C.S. Lewis said he's either "Lord, liar or lunatic." Too many people have died claiming Christ was who he said he was, and they were killed by being skinned alive, burned at the stake, all proclaiming the same thing. You don't die for something that's a lie. I believe in the afterlife and Christ is The Way to that life. It's a shame that we can be so skeptical about something that should be the top thing on our list. I guess I shouldn't be too surprised though...I just now saw the "most recent questions" posted right below where I'm now typing. Wow, judging by the questions asked here, it certainly proves my point that we're more interested in the very silly and temporary things of this world. I will continue to pray for our nation.

Jason Believes
Amen Sister - you said it all...

I agree with Jason...

And yet here you type what you 'believe' to be true about people who have a simple child-like faith. Everyone believes something; even the 'brilliant' evolutionists, scientists, professors - you name it. The fact remains that there are some things that there has never been empirical evidence for OR against. Sure, you can hold on to a belief that life is meaningless, and everything is an some cosmic 'accident'. But then human emotions and ideas like hopes, dreams, LOVE, and PURPOSE are all meaningless to a person who thinks like that. Me - I will stick to having hopes and dreams. I will stick to truly loving family and friends (not just having an 'emotional response to social stimuli'). I will serve my purpose in life, which is to glorify God, and believe with ALL MY HEART that Jesus is who He said He is. Of course, you can believe what you want - Heaven Forbid believing in anything BIGGER THAN YOURSELF.

... primitive concepts? Some things never change. Thank God for that.

If you think hopes, dreams, LOVE, and PURPOSE are meaningless just because someone rejects a belief in the Supernatural, I pity you. I'm no believer, but hopes, dreams, and Love are all the Purpose I need. Sure, there are very arrogant nonbelievers...just like there are arrogant believers like you, Jason.

Something about motes and beams comes to mind...but that's your choice of faiths, not mine.

I don't need an invisible man in the sky or some ancient textbook written by MEN to tell me how to live a happy, healthy, loving life. I can do that all on my own using RATIONAL THOUGHT PROCESSES.

AMEN!!! well spoken

Darwin-1572353
It is hard to believe that in this time of human existence that so many people are hanging onto such primitive concepts. In fact, it is an embarassment, but then again, given so many still believe in things like gods and the fantasy connected with them, I am not surprised. The common factor among these types is that they substantiate their words by stating They have no proof but society is supposed to accept and respect them just because they BELIEVE it in their (demented) minds! This is acceptable if you are 4 years old but for an adult to profess such nonsense is the waste of a human mind. Adult believers do profess such "nonsense" (obviously it's not nonsense to us) and you might want to be a little more careful about making your diagnosis of our supposedly "demented" minds. (Correct me if I am wrong;I am assuming you are not a licensed physician.)

Attempting to diagnose dementia (or attempting to make any diagnosis) without a license to practice medicine might not be the best choice to make...

Your mind is gone if you believe the story you just told!

Darwin - "you can't handle the truth" can you? I presume you are a huge believer in evolution. Can't prove that exactly can you?

Darwin-1572353
Your mind is gone if you believe the story you just told!

That is your opinion; it's not necessarily the truth...Christians may choose to believe..the title of this discussion forum is not what we can prove by scientific facts, but what we believe...Two entirely different things...

So your "evidence" is what you think your grandmother saw towards the end of her life after her brain had slowly rotten away? That's pretty weak.

Kuro -- no matter what you believe there is no reason to be mean to someone who lost someone they love and believe something comforting that is meaningful to them! They have every right to their beliefs just as you do. Their experience is just as valid as yours

So your "evidence" is what you think your grandmother saw towards the end of her life after her brain had slowly rotten away? That's pretty weak.

And that's pretty offensive.

Sounds like you need some character work.

Aegis500
So your "evidence" is what you think your grandmother saw towards the end of her life after her brain had slowly rotten away? That's pretty weak.

And that's pretty offensive.

Sounds like you need some character work.

Not as much as you do, though.

Well, I guess you would know.

Aegis500
Well, I guess you would know.

Well, I know that you don't.

Niecy1126, you just described how my father transitioned back into spirit energy. I do not call it death, for I believe we are immortal. Our spirit continues on its journey forward, toward perfection (as opposed to going 'up to heaven' or 'down to hell'.).

Those of us who have experienced spiritual energy in all of its forms do not debate it existance. It's pointless to do so because people want something that they can hear, feel, see, touch or even taste to prove its existance. It is a waste of time to look for "ghosts" when we are ourselves, are "ghosts" (or spirit energy) in physical human form. There is no difference between 'here' and 'there'. We are who we are, whether in human form or as spirit energy. Energy does not 'die'.

The mortal need for empirical proof is a human weakness of Ego. All the answers are within; you just need to learn to be quiet and listen with Faith and Love.

Kuro-1572859
So your "evidence" is what you think your grandmother saw towards the end of her life after her brain had slowly rotten away? That's pretty weak.

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!#11.1 - Wed Jan 20, 2010 1:02 PM EST
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Dorothy in Oz
Kuro -- no matter what you believe there is no reason to be mean to someone who lost someone they love and believe something comforting that is meaningful to them! They have every right to their beliefs just as you do. Their experience is just as valid as yours

Sorry, I have to agree with Dorothy on this one...What we experience is unique to each individual person...Just because someone else doesn't believe someone else's experience is genuine doesn't mean that it's not genuine to the person who lives through it. Each person on this planet has different life experiences which are solely his/hers...Not believing someone else's beliefs is no excuse for being mean or cruel...I am a Christian but I don't try to intentionally be mean or ridicule others...each person makes his/her own decision. I decided long ago to "take the gamble" that there is an afterlife; if I am wrong, then I am wrong....Time will tell...

Well, color me convinced...

Seriously, I was waiting for the LOL to show up. If you ever hope to convince anyone of your experiences, it would help if you learned to type in something other than junior high schoolgirl shorthand.

There are no descriptions in the Bible concerning heaven, what it looks like, what's going on there, or about "Heaven's Gate".

Another idiot we have to deal with!

Darwin 1572353 - what we perceive in regard to others is only a manifistation of what resides within ourselves.

and_voila
There are no descriptions in the Bible concerning heaven, what it looks like, what's going on there, or about "Heaven's Gate".

Yes, there are quite a few descriptions of what Heaven looks like (in descriptions of earthly words) in the Bible.

Belief in things like supernatural creators, afterlife, etc, etc, based only on an a feeling one gets is an indication of a mental illness.

Actually, barring any proving or disproving of the existence of any supernatural creators, afterlife, etc., etc., ... one's opinion on the subject is a matter of viewpoint, which is the right of each of us as human beings.

The 20th century has proven, decisively, that there will be crazies on either side of the believing dividing line.

Aegis500

Actually, barring any proving or disproving of the existence of any supernatural creators, afterlife, etc., etc., ... one's opinion on the subject is a matter of viewpoint, which is the right of each of us as human beings.

Hmm. As far as I know, no one has disproved the existence of Thor. And there is evidence that Thor might exist, since there is a statue of him:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Torsfiske_002.jpg

Therefore one is justified in believing that thunder is caused by Thor's maneuvers with his hammer?

The 20th century has proven, decisively, that there will be crazies on either side of the believing dividing line.

Except that the crazies on the "believing" side is significantly larger. By orders of magnitude.

BTW, it is common ploy to present the division as if it is equal. Please try not to indulge in that deceptive tactic, or someone might catch on that you are being willfully dishonest.

Except that the crazies on the "believing" side is significantly larger. By orders of magnitude.

Whether that is true or not is, simply, so much presumption from those with your particular viewpoint.

However, what cannot be denied is that it is the unbelieving crazies who have taken the lives of more persons in the 20th century, than any other group in the history of mankind.

And that, despite their apparent paucity of number.

BTW, it is common ploy to present the division as if it is equal. Please try not to indulge in that deceptive tactic, or someone might catch on that you are being willfully dishonest.

By the way, it's just as common a ploy to present your preferred aargument as so-called "common knowledge", rather that the very personal opinion which it is.

Aegis500

Whether that is true or not is, simply, so much presumption from those with your particular viewpoint.

It is true, no presumption needed.

However, what cannot be denied is that it is the unbelieving crazies who have taken the lives of more persons in the 20th century, than any other group in the history of mankind.

Actually it can be and is. Unless of course you can show that unbelieving crazies did so because of their unbelief.

And you can't. Because to act requires some belief. In something. No one acts to do something because of not believing in something else.

By the way, it's just as common a ploy to present your preferred aargument as so-called "common knowledge", rather that the very personal opinion which it is.

Indeed, so stop using that ploy. It paints you in a poorer light.

However, what cannot be denied is that it is the unbelieving crazies who have taken the lives of more persons in the 20th century, than any other group in the history of mankind.

Actually it can be and is. Unless of course you can show that unbelieving crazies did so because of their unbelief.

And you can't. Because to act requires some belief. In something. No one acts to do something because of not believing in something else.

Actually, this is irrelevant to the original point.

The original point was that believers were, inherently, crazies.

My counterpoint was that belief has nothing to do with mental illness, as unbelieving individuals and groups have proved just as crazy, if not more.

Aegis500:

However, what cannot be denied is that it is the unbelieving crazies who have taken the lives of more persons in the 20th century, than any other group in the history of mankind.

Actually it can be and is. Unless of course you can show that unbelieving crazies did so because of their unbelief.

And you can't. Because to act requires some belief. In something. No one acts to do something because of not believing in something else.

Actually, this is irrelevant to the original point.

Then you should not brought up the irrelevance in the first place.

The original point was that believers were, inherently, crazies.

In as much as they believe in things without verifiable and falsifiable evidence, like the afterlife, they are inherently crazy.

But that was not the original point. The original point was you conveniently pointing out that there are crazies on both sides, neglecting to mention the proportions of each side.

For this, I chided you, and it got the discussion this far.

My counterpoint was that belief has nothing to do with mental illness, as unbelieving individuals and groups have proved just as crazy, if not more.

Your counterpoint lacks evidence, so is duly dismissed. Please resubmit when you have some verifiable and falsifiable evidence.

My counterpoint was that belief has nothing to do with mental illness, as unbelieving individuals and groups have proved just as crazy, if not more.

Your counterpoint lacks evidence, so is duly dismissed. Please resubmit when you have some verifiable and falsifiable evidence.

So you conveniently ignore the craziness of the unbelievers in the Soviet Union and Communist China ?

Their lack of belief certainly didn't immunize them from the crazies. They believed as you do ... that it all should be done away with. And they tried ... to the tune of 100 million people dead.

And then the (majority) believing West overcame their evil anyway.

Darwin The prisons are filled with people who decided they were more important and/or smarter than someone else that they committed a proveable crime and actually were caught. One could argue that once you have decided you are smarter than other people, that you actually have a mental illness.

Consider Adolf Hitler, Karl Marx, Saul Alinski, The Unibomber, any serial killer.

Belief in things like supernatural creators, afterlife, etc, etc, based only on an a feeling one gets is an indication of a mental illness.

Attempting to diagnose mental illness (or attempting to make any diagnosis) without a license to practice medicine might not be the best choice to make... Correct me if I'm wrong; I am guessing you're not a licensed physician...

Hmmmm ...quite possible....

Mr. Sagan never completed an analysis of an NDE. Millions of people have reported seeing Jesus,God, angels, or passed relatives. Mr. Sagan's avoidance of these critical components that define most NDEs makes his assertions less credible. This compels one to believe that he doesn't offer anything but partially addressed theories

"Millions of people have reported seeing Jesus,God, angels, or passed relatives." You cannot possibly know the mind of millions of people who have claimed seeing Jesus or God unless you claim you are omniscient. You accuse Sagan of making assertions yet yours about what other people report seeing has absolutely no credibility. We have to take your word for it.

There is also the fact that the vision centers of the brain are located to the back of the skull. As circulation fails blood will tend to slow and pool in this area. This may explain the visual phantasms reported in NDE's. The brain is no longer getting input as the nerves from the eyes have gone dormant do to lack of blood but the processing centers are getting blood due to the pooling effect. So the processors processs without input. They are very good at this they do it every night. It is called dreaming.

beautiful story. thanks for sharing ...you should blog.

I am unsure about an afterlife. Logically, it doesn't make much sense but then why is there such a strong gut feeling of *something* more?

There is nothing illogical after an afterlife. What is illogical is to believe that there is one, without a shred of evidence of it.

The "gut" feeling you refer to is simply wishful thinking. Most people do not want to do, and hope that they will exist forever. Hardly a "gut" feeling worth mentioning since it is just another fantasy. People have "gut" feelings that they will win at Vegas -- countless life-savings lost prove this.

In Lynne McTaggert's books "The Field" and "The Intention Experiment" she writes about research that has looked at connections between people and plants and people and animals and there is scientific evidence that shows that our cells are affected by those with whom we connect. It has been shown between effects on plant growth and electronic measurements and the emotions of the owner/caretaker of the plant, whether they are in the room or hundreds of miles away. Evidence for telepathy has been repeatedly shown in experiments. So such a connection with a dog is not your imagination. The same evidence can be shown between twins or between mothers and their children.

HumanSimpleton; Actually I read something about how humans' minds are hard-wired if you will to believe in an afterlife. I wish I remembered what article this was! If that would be the case then there would indeed be a valid difference between "gut feeling" and merely wishful thinking.

DHD, I do find that fascinating.

HumanSimpleton; Actually I read something about how humans' minds are hard-wired if you will to believe in an afterlife.

I read that people will believe anything they read as long as it agrees with their held beliefs.

Very true!

Can I see this study or any data showing that past lives are "scientifically proven"?

@Kuro: if you get it please forward me a copy ;)

Dr. Ian Stevenson studied many many reports of children remembering their past lives and how they died, who their family members were, where they lived, what they did for a living, and showed evidence of birthmarks in the exact spots where a fatal injury was indicated on the person they claimed to be in their past life.

There is a fairly well-believed theory that at or around the time of a person passing, they will visit those they love/loved - the one/ones closest to them. I don't remember the site now, but there was an article about a Psychiatrist or Psychologist that was working w/ war vets and found a fairly common thing happening...the people either experienced a visit or talked to family members that had been visited by the deceased soldiers. This was a subject that the doctor was not comfortable with but couldn't deny what was repeatedly being said or experienced by these Veterans.

Why jump to the conclusion that there are actual visitations? Our brains can and often do ease our fears by hallucinating before death.

@Kuro: I'm with you

There is a book called "At the Hour of Death" written by Karlis Osis that describes a study done based on the accounts of doctors and nurses in the US and India (in order to compare different cultures with differing religious beliefs and cultural beliefs about death/afterlife). Thousands of doctors and nurses were interviewed about their patients who had died in the hospital and what these health care providers witnessed. A majority had indicated that their dying patients saw and responded to some non-physical spirit or person or other entity that was communicating with them and/or meeting them to take them. Even people who were not expected to die and were going to be sent home who reported seeing these visions were dead within hours of seeing the visions.

There is a book called "Otherworld Journeys" in which the author compares reports of near death experiences today to those reported in the Middle Ages. So these are not new, and they are similar in content.

There is a Journal of Near Death Studies that publishes articles about this topic and some of the evidence is fascinating and hard to dispute.

In addition, there is currently a study being done by 50 hospitals around the world that is looking at reports of out-of-body and near-death experiences by people in the operating room -- with some controls for evidence that what these people are saying is true. So apparently some in the medical community are open-minded enough to look at what they are being told and investigate it rather than just blow it off as some sort of lack of oxygen to the brain--which requires as much faith to believe in (what some refer to as fundamaterialism)as what the patients are saying actually happened.

When you know something, you must have proof; your fairy tale is exactly that!

Only mathematics requires proof of anything. Science requires only evidence, and many things we take for granted in our daily lives are based on evidence without proof.

Anecdotes and hallucinations do not equal proof. I have heard several of these "stories" from my friends throughout my life. The only difference is that they were not being guided to heaven by their loved ones after death; they were peaking on certain kinds of drugs. Why do people report the same experience wether it is drug induced or a "near life experience"? They are described exactly the same way. Why is that?

My wife Donna is a true CDEr. She died in 1984 twice on the operating table. The Drs. told me it was the anesthesia. Over the years she has had all the classic signs of the Experience. Even when her brother suffered a fatal gunshot and given less than a 5 percent chance of surviving she knew he would make it. He is alive today. In 2007 my mother was dying. She was old and not in good health. Though mom had numerous strokes and life threatening operations over the years Donna always knew what to have me do and say and when to be there. It just wasn't mom's time till late May 2007. The week of mom's death Donna told me she would be seeing other dimensions and talking to her already deceased loved ones. My sister during one of her stays told me mom had seen dad. Mom indeed said to me between her alternating states that she had seen her parents. It was the night that mom died that was the most strikingly relevant experience for me (a non DEr). The doctor told us that mom could go at anytime in the next few days. Donna told me to stay at mom's side and not leave her and that it would be that night. I sat in a chair across from mom's bed. My brother and his wife had taken to the bed next to mom's. I drifted off a couple of times as I sat there but at about 4:30am I was jolted out of my sleep by an overwhelming feeling that I cannot describe. I got up and went next to mom. As she lay struggling for breath I put my hand on her chest and told her the words that Donna said to me earlier. "Mom it is alright, Dad is here for you, that everything is fine and it's your time" Within a few minutes she took her last breath and died. Later that morning I called Donna but I didn't have to tell her mom had passed. She had known exactly what time mom died and that mom had even come to her. Her and dad were together again.

Our brain has evolved as a hyper-active agency detector to see causality and patterns that don't exist and to see things that are wishful thinking.

When your mother said "Teacher oh Teacher" she could as easily have had a nightmare where she showed up for an exam and studied for the wrong subject as seeing another imaginary person that probably never existed but has been the subject of myth for 2000 years and has been deeply engraved in our brain from a very young age.

There is evidence of many people who were not medicated who experienced deathbed visions or NDEs.

Not being open to the possibilities of the experiences people have is not being open to finding out that what one believes may not be true and they may have to change the way they see things -- like changing their minds that the earth is not flat, but round--that the earth is NOT the center of the universe but one planet of many in a solar system circling the sun. Finding out that you don't know it all can be a b*tch. Even Einstein knew he didn't know it all. And he knew more than most, if not all, of the people posting here.

yea ur right. we have to live this life. its great and we should embrace it even the hard times.

:::"AND since most of the religions of today deem such experiences to be 'of the devil' 'witchcraft' 'evil' and discounted since 'they' are going to hell for believing such things' etc etc"::::

most religions. u mean christianity? theres so many religions that would accept this idea. please stay openminded about religions.

Do you need the name of a good psychiatrist? You are seriously ill.

For all of you who have posted comments about "why would a good and loving God let this happen....... "

This is not heaven. This is a life where we are given a choice, for good or evil. Try to understand that as believers, we are believers in Christ but that in doing so, we acknowledge the fact there is a devil and demons who exist as well. This is the devils playground. You see it every day in news papers, on tv, radio etc... Make your choice to believe what you will. The devil wants you to be safe in your intelligence and call all of us a bunch of scared little dimwits. The devil wants you to believe there is no heaven and clearly he is making great strides if this poll is at all accurate. I pray all of you will see past the judgements of men and search your hearts for the truth. It might make you feel like a child again, but thats ok. The sad thing is that people are just scared to believe there is a Love so wonderful and powerful that it can take away your pain and sorrow- this would mean letting go of the so called control you think you have over your own life. Regenerate, Repent, Reform.

So intelligent people that do not believe in "your" god are being controlled by the devil? It would be hilarious if you did not actually believe it.

"The sad thing is that people are just scared to believe there is a Love so wonderful and powerful that it can take away your pain and sorrow- this would mean letting go of the so called control you think you have over your own life."

Please explain why people would be scared of a love so powerful that it takes away pain and sorrow? That does not make any sense.

I said nothing about being 'controlled by the devil'. You have made your own reality out of what you can control. Belief in something omnipotent requires denial of notion that you are the ultimate master of your own universe. And yes, scared. Scared to give up control and admit God exists. Scared that you will be made a fool of by your friends if you say you believe in Christ. What do you have faith in? Yourself? If you can love so passionately, imagine Gods love for us.

Tru..
Regenerate, Repent, Reform.

you can believe whatevr you want...I don't need or want you to trying to shove it down my throat

you believe what you want and I'll believe what I want